My Experience

I do want to mention that my experience at Turo has been pretty much great for the most part.  I never really ran into any problems until the staff at Turo reached out to me, and told me that I had to remove my photos, and put up new photos.

When I pushed back on this, and got escalated up to the last person who delisted, and disabled my account, she stated that what I was doing is ok.  But by this time, exchanges got pretty pushy.

I guess you can say that I am sort of a bone head sure,  but after reading their Acceptable Use Policy,  It didn’t make sense for me to allow them walk all over me.

Now,  since their “decision is final“, even tho they made the mistake.  I have no problem posting these emails, and names.  I have to be honest with you.  I feel like they attacked me, and unsure even why they attacked me.

I am just going to timeline this to make it very easy for everybody.

On 06/30/2017, I was contacted by Alejandra Alzate from Turo support.
“Hi Michael,

Thanks for being a host on Turo!

We recently reviewed your vehicle’s listing and we noticed you have uploaded photos of your vehicle Michael’s MetalCloak Jeep off the road. We do not allow our owners to upload pictures of that kind since it is a prohibited use. Please upload photos of your personal vehicle to ensure that it is properly represented.”

I responded back with that I understood that offroading was prohibited use, and I did not condone that,  I merely uses these pictures to capture peoples interests. I merely used it to promote my automobile, and make it stick out.

Alejandra Alzate (Turo Support) Jun 30, 10:40 PDT
Hi Michael,

I understand that your photos are a marketing strategy. Unfortunately we can not allow this type of advertisement since it promotes the prohibited uses outlined in our policy. This policy is there for your protection. In the case of a traveler damaging your vehicle while committing a prohibited use, insurance would not cover your vehicle.

I apologize if you feel like having your pictures removed is unnecessary, but our goal is to prevent any inconveniences that can be presented to you as an owner and to the travelers that book your vehicle.

If you have any questions I will be happy to help you.

Kind Regards,

Alejandra
Customer Support

This is when I read the Acceptable Use Policy, and realized that while it does say they prohibit offroading, it does not say that you cannot have pictures of this.  This is where I told Alejandra that I would get these pictures back on Turo.

Diane (Turo Support) Jul 5, 12:37 PDT
Hi Michael,
Thank you for your reply.

We take our policies very seriously. I see that your photos are still outside of our policy, so I have restricted your vehicle. Please update the photos on your car page and let us know when you have done so that we can reactivate it.

They delisted my account, and I continued to work with them. This is when I told the current renters when they picked up the Jeep that Turo was giving me a rough time about having pictures of offroading on their site to promote my vehicle.  They said that was crazy, because the only reason they rented my vehicle is because the pictures caught their attention.

Michael Wallace Jul 5, 14:50 PDT

Diane,

You take it so seriously, that it took you over a year to come to me….

Matter a fact, the renter that is renting my jeep right now thinks this
policy is absolutely bonkers, and to be honest with you, I wont hesitate
telling people about my experience dealing with this matter if it
continues. I’ve seen plenty of pictures of owners cars that did not “meet”
Turo’s policy EXACTLY. People use photos to market their cars, and thats
simply what I am doing. I am basically telling my audience, “My jeep is
bad ass, and it will be able to get you anywhere you want to go”.

I’ve uploaded photos that meet all requires set forth by Turo, and should
suffice.

I appreciate your time in this matter, but honestly your ignorance…
Never mind.

Have a lovely day.

Thanks,

Michael

The Next day they responded back to the two new photos that I posted.

I posted these photos.  Yes, I meant to make them look this horrible..  But at lease my Jeep was on pavement that they so graciously wanted.

Diane (Turo Support) Jul 6, 09:55 PDT

Hi Micheal,

Thank you for your response. Unfortunately the two new photos you uploaded do not adhere to our policy. I can understand your frustration as it takes time to get new professional quality photos of your car in such short notice. We had given you one week to get them replaced before restricting your vehicle.

I understand that the connotation of having your vehicle off road says “…it will be able to get you anywhere you want to go.” Unfortunately Turo policy prohibits it’s uses off road, which these photos are promoting. It would very unfortunate if a traveler was to get into an accident while off road, because the insurance Turo provides might not cover it in that case.

As for your current and upcoming reservations, they are still good to go, but you will not receive any new bookings until the vehicle is reactivated.

Please provide us with new photos, not altered photos, of your vehicle and we will be happy to reactivate your Jeep.

All the best,

Diane
Customer Support

Little bit of back and forth with Diane, and I receive an email from Turo Corporate Subject Line “An ode to the US National Parks”.

First vehicle that they are promoting is right here.

https://turo.com/rentals/suvs/ut/salt-lake-city/hummer-h1/225751?utm_source=whatcounts&utm_medium=free:email&utm_campaign=:free:wu:170710_National_Park_US

When I see this, I INSTANTLY call them out on the harassment that they put me through.

Michael Wallace Jul 10, 15:46 PDT

Oh Hello Diane!

So this is what I find incredibly funny, and now I understand less why you
guys are attacking me.

I get this email FROM YOU GUYS….

“An ode to the US National Parks”.

Skylar’s H1.
https://turo.com/rentals/suvs/ut/salt-lake-city/hummer-h1/225751?utm_source=
whatcounts&utm_medium=free:email&utm_campaign=:free:wu:170710_National_Park_
US

Bunch of pictures of offroading, this is included in your VETTED email
thread just today…

Are you guys to use force, and coercion against Skylar to get him to change
his pictures as he is “promoting offroading”?

I’d love to hear the response from this.

Why is it ok for some people to use these pictures, and honestly, you
cannot say, “Well we didn’t know about it!”. Because you guys PROMOTED it
in your email thread… So why is it ok for some people to have them, and
Turo knows about it, and others like myself cannot get away with it?

IT was acceptable because it was badass to be able to drive a vehicle that
CAN do this sort of stuff, not really a promotion, but its confidence in
an automobile, isn’t it?

Even Turo can knowingly PROMOTE vehicles with similar images that I did,
and its PROMOTED BY YOUR COMPANY…

Yet, I am the asshole aren’t I?

If my account is not reinstated within the next 24 hours, domain
Turofraud.com/Turosucks.com/Turocomplaint.com will be purchased, and my
story will be made accessible and readable by every person looking for or
searching for rental cars. I run a very large web hosting business, and
understand how SEO works, and how to use it to my advantage.

Thank you so much for your time Diane!

Disgruntled,

Michael Wallace

This is where they transfer me to Angeline one of Turo Supervisors on the support team.

Angeline (Turo Support) Jul 11, 09:06 PDT

Hi Michael,

Thanks for being an owner on Turo!

I am one of the supervisors on the support team and Diane has escalated your case up to me. I understand that your car listing contains photos of your Jeep on grass. I am sorry that you feel like you’ve been attacked as this was not our intention.

I understand that this has been a very frustrating experience as you are correct, our company does include photos of cars off-roading so I could understand why it might seem unclear why we would not want owners in our marketplace to do the same.

I wanted to go ahead and clarify that the photos you have of your Jeep on the grass are fine to keep up but we will need you to add at least one photo of your car on pavement. We want to ensure that travelers see your car in more than just an off-roading capacity. We also ask that you add a line in your car listing that states that off-roading is prohibited. Lastly, we will need you to remove the photoshopped photos of your car as we do not permit photoshopped or stock images. All photos must actually be of the car itself in a real location.

Once all of the above has been achieved, we’d be happy to reinstate your listing. We look forward to hearing from you!

All the best,

Angeline
Customer Support Supervisor

Angeline, takes the same path as the first two support people.

Michael Wallace Jul 11, 12:30 PDT

Angeline,

Here is the problem…. You are telling me that what I am doing is against
AUP…. HOWEVER Corporate Turo is PROMOTING people who are doing the SAME
thing that I am doing.

Yet, I am harassed, violated, and mistreated by your staff. Now I
understand that you’ve got to back them up, even tho their actions were
immoral, and wrong. Yet for some reason I remain the asshole.

You have to understand where I come from from a moral standpoint before you
really understand where I am going with this.

Me posting pictures of the vehicle with difference scenes was never the
issue or the problem here… problem here is someone got mad at me, and is
trying to throw the book at me. While other people on Turo, are openly
promoted by Turo Corporate for the same thing that I am doing, they wont
be contacted, their accounts will not be blocked, or banned… Yet I am…
We are here right now. Yet for some reason I remain the asshole.

I told the original lady that I will going to crap up and down her
“policy”. Because when I joined turo, I looked at what kind of pictures
other jeep owners were posting, and this was it. Yet, I am the asshole.

We remain here in this state of flux. Other can post bad ass pictures of
where they’ve taken their vehicles, and you can see it all over turo.

I’ve put up a site. http://turofraud.com. I am willing to post what has
transpired, and my findings to the public. This honestly would not bode
well for you. I do charge 2500 dollars to remove these sites after I put
the time into them to put them up.

This is one way how the free market works to correct these problems. The
free market solutions always work better than anything else. What sucks
the most is I was happy with everything until I was harassed by your
underlings.

none the less, please let me know how you would like to proceed with
this.

I appreciate your time.

Thanks,

Michael Wallace

Maybe a little too salty for them.  I still do not understand why they are attacking me. I finally get escalated to Lauren, which is the manager for the customer support team.  I apologize Lauren if you are a guy.  I mean no disrespect.

Lauren (Turo Support) Jul 12, 09:40 PDT

Hello Michael,

Thank you for your messages. Angeline has escalated your concerns to me; my name is Lauren and I am the manager for the Customer Support team here at Turo.

I apologize that, initially, our message to you was confusing. It is true that Turo occasionally uses pictures of cars off-roading for marketing purposes. It’s also true that off-roading in vehicles is a prohibited use, and voids the protection that a traveler receives (and sometimes the owner as well) if something occurs to the vehicle while the car is being driven off-road. This led to some confusion with some of our agents; some agents were not aware that we allow photographs of off-roading on listings, so when they receive a report about a listing with off-roading photographs, they believe they have to ensure the car is restricted until all the off-roading photographs are removed. (This is due to a mix-up in training on my part, and we’re doing our best to rectify that training.) In actuality, Angeline is correct: When we’re made aware of listings with off-roading photographs, we request that those owners add at least one photograph of the vehicle on an actual paved road, and add a disclaimer on the listing specifying that off-roading is a prohibited use. This is to protect the vehicle owner from their car being damaged while off-roading, as permitting someone to go off-roading in your vehicle would void your coverage from us as well.

We have hundreds of thousands of listings on our website, so we’re not going to get to all of the listings very quickly to fix them. However, we do want to ensure all our listings meet our standards of excellence, which includes not misleading customers into believing that off-roading won’t cause any problems for their coverage. I sincerely apologize that my team’s efforts to inform owners about our policies has caused you any inconvenience.

We are very concerned about the website you’ve made that specifically targets a Turo employee. I’ve reviewed the entire case: Our employees were simply requesting that you follow our policies, which are in place for your own protection; admittedly they made a mistake, and when Angeline was alerted to it, she did her best to rectify it. She notified you that removing all the photographs wasn’t necessary, and that only following certain instructions was. Angeline was professional and courteous throughout her response, and provided you with a reasonable resolution. Your response and creation of this site that attempts to shame in return her is absolutely not in line with the behavior we expect from our owners, as outlined in our Community guidelines: https://turo.com/policies/community-guidelines

Please remove all mentions of Angeline and any other Turo employees from your website immediately. We will evaluate you account standing once we have confirmation that this has been done.

Thank you,

Lauren
Customer Support Manager

Ok,  So I called them out for their misinformation, and misunderstanding the AUP, and Lauren acknowledges that.  PERFECT.  So the AUP says that this is acceptable, but because I hurt the other support peoples feelings,  I am the jerk face.  “Our employees were simply requesting that you follow our policies”.  Your support people were misinforming me about what the support policies were for, and obviously showing pictures of your vehicle off of pavement is NOT against your AUP.

Michael Wallace Jul 13, 09:14 PDT

Hello Lauren,

Just tried to log into my account and getting this now. Instead of just my
listing being delisted, appears my account has been disabled.

Does this mean war? I really do not want it to go here… I also
understand that you must take the stance of your people before me, to save
face…. Sort of a “bros before hoes” stance. I only stand for morality,
so I only stand with that.

Thanks,

Michael

I probably shouldn’t have said “bros before hoes” I was more along the line of thinking back up your family, or those around you.  But still.

Lauren (Turo Support) Jul 13, 13:52 PDT

Hello Michael,

Thank you for your detailed responses, and thanks for your patience.

I’m sorry that you feel you have been lied to; to be frank, I’m not sure what you’re referring to when you say that we’ve “lied”. If you’re familiar with the insurance industry, then I imagine you are aware that insurance for the car-sharing industry is very new (and different from the ride-sharing industry). Turo self-insures for comprehensive and collision damage, and we partner with Liberty Mutual for our liability insurance. Therefore any “lies” you are referring to would not be related to our insurance policy, as we set our own policy on comprehensive and collision damage.

To me, it seems the lies you’re referring to would only be about the fact that we asked you to remove off-roading photographs, when what should have occurred was just the instructions to add an additional picture, remove photoshopped pictures, and add a line about our off-roading policy — which I have already explained was an unfortunate and graceless mistake and misunderstanding, caused by our own out-of-date training, and not a deliberate attempt to inconvenience you.

Unfortunately, while I understand your frustration, the behavior you’ve exhibited throughout your exchanges with my staff and with me is not in line with the Community guidelines I’ve already provided you with. Furthermore, Turo reserves the right to refuse or revoke membership for any reason; from a legal perspective, we endeavor to follow all of our policies to the letter, including our Community guidelines, when revoking membership. Throughout this exchange, it’s become clear that Turo is not a good fit for you, so at this time I have closed and deactivated your account; you are no longer permitted to rent out your vehicle(s) on our network. For auditing and tax purposes we do not delete owners’ accounts from our system, but I have closed it, which means it is inactive and inaccessible. You will no longer receive messages from our system.

If you have additional questions or concerns, please don’t hesitate to let me know. I wish you the best of luck with your future car-sharing endeavors.

Kind Regards,

Lauren
Customer Support Manager

“Unfortunate and graceless mistake and misunderstanding, caused by our own out-of-date training.” Perfect!  So we can get past this right?  This was a mistake caused by your staff, and we can get back on track right?  wrong…  By this time, I am still banned from their website for THEIR mistake, and misunderstanding of THEIR OWN POLICIES.

Michael Wallace Jul 13, 17:23 PDT

Lauren,

Lies…. Deceit, deception, dishonesty, disinformation, distortion,
fabrication, falsehood, fiction, inaccuracy, myth, perjury, tale, Its all
the same…

You are very correct… Before my listing was revoked, and my account
disabled. They should have made sure that they understood what these AUP’s
were, and how they applied. Just like you said, they should have told me
to add a photo, not remove all off-roading photos used for marketing, as
you’ve stated is ok.

The behavior that I’ve exhibited? If you want to revoke my access to your
companies website. So be it. But nothing I’ve said, nor my behavior has
been harmful to anybody in your staff. I stated fact, and wanted to get
down to reason. Finally after countless hours of dealing with your staff,
I finally got You… Someone that KNOWS What she is talking about. If
that is not in line with community guidelines. Then so be it. I have this
capability of seeing through the deceit, and deception, and pushed through
peaceful resolve.

I want it noticed that AFTER banging my head up against the wall with
Angelina, and posted the website that I did, did I only get YOU…
Someone that knows what she is talking about. It wasn’t until I CALLED out
the deceit of Angelina, that I got someone who knows what they are talking
about.

Turo was a great fit for me until your staff attacked me, and delisted my
vehicle. I’ve had no problems with Turo until this time, and was a great
pleasure working with the people who have rented from me. I want that
noted. I will also be sending an email to your CEO to notify him of this
negligence as well. I am very sure that Andre would not appreciate the
deceit that has transpired from your staff that you manage.

I’ve been a model Turo renter until you guys started poking me. That’s
very apparent, from my feedback from all of the renters. If anything this
is a GREAT learning experience for you and your staff on how to NOT handle
the people that put food on your table.

Whats funny, is I am the nicest, friendliest guy, and will do what I can do
facilite ANYBODY… But you have to admit there is negligence in this
isn’t there? This all started from misinformation from your staff, and its
escalated to this point where you find it necessary, to ban me… Still
have no idea why… But this is where we are.

Your move. COB Friday, and story goes live, and I am sure Mr. Haddad will
not be happy about it. I know as a CEO myself, I wouldn’t.

Thanks,

Michael Wallace

The next day, I get this response back from Lauren.

Lauren (Turo Support) Jul 14, 11:27 PDT

Hello Michael,

Thank you for your response. Our decision is final; I sincerely regret that our business relationship did not work out.

I hope you have a wonderful weekend,

Lauren
Customer Support Manager

This concludes my correspondence with Turo.  I doubt they will talk to me any further.  So now I must rely on them not wanting people to see this, and make things right.  I didn’t break any rules, I made this a nice amount of cash, and over a year down the road, I had a great experience with the renters, and Turo in general.  I would work with them again, as I enjoyed meeting people, and talking with the people.  Over all the people that purchase time in your vehicle are simply having a great time.  It saddens me that they will no longer be able to have fun in my vehicles anymore.

I sort of built this thing so others can have fun in it.  There is almost a sense of pride, and freedom, and countless people complimenting you for the vehicle you drive.

I appreciate your time, and would like others not to get tricked by “Unfortunate and graceless mistake and misunderstanding, caused by our own out-of-date training.”.

It sort of sucks that even tho they realized that the peril of this was not anything that I did,  but of their own out-of-date training.  Even tho they understand this, they are not willing to make things right.